Putting sand in a seive represents making no advancements. The sand just falls through and he continues to try. Maybe, Montag will try and try again, but none of his ideas will stay...just fall through.
I agree with Garrett when he says that knowledge flows in one ear and out the other ear. They don't really pay attention to it, because their government has trained them to not think about anything. They are simply brainwashed.
The sieve represents himself and the books represent the sand because as much as he tries to understand the books and cram information in to his head, he can't remember or comprehend it.
@mickaela, I think that this is very representative of the state of mind that Montag is in. I think that he will definetly try, and I would like to see him fail, at least at first. It would seem too perfect and too easy if his rebellion succeeds...
Haley is right, because people in this society have been trained to not comprehend knowledge. They have never had to comprehend knowledge in their life, so it's a struggle to comprehend knowledge.
I think that when this is brought up, it's like a metaphor saying that the knowledge he is trying to obtain is just leaving him. Sure he can have the knowledge for a little while, but he's not used to remembering facts like we are, so he loses everything he read. Just like the sand is leaving the seive.
How would the society react to books being distributed...even if it is a little at a time? Would they be accepting, or would the "sand fall through the sieve" and everyone be angry...rejecting...and not accepting of this change?!
The plan is to frame the other firemen, that way with firemen gone, it will no longer be illegal to keep books. But how will they intrigue society to want to read books again and gain knowledge?
I agree with Grace that if montag gets all the other firmen in trouble with books by telling on them to Beatty or someone in authority that they would come gunning for revenge.
I agree with Mrs. Moritz because while Faber is using him as a service to himslef, Montag is also getting help with realizing what he has to do with the books
I think Michaela is right when she says that he is trying to figure out how to use his knowledge. Do you know how to use something to the best of its abilites when you first get it? (rhetorical question). Montag is dealing with the same thing as we currently deal it.
Garrett, I think Faber knows someone who has taken books, maybe it was a fireman, but I don't think it had to be. Does it seem like Faber is keeping information from Montag, even after he gave Montag the ear piece?
@ Rebecca - You're right, the book would defintley be boring and too predictable if his plan is successful on attempt #1. Do you think he is he going to be successful eventually, how long will it take?
i thnk the peole have been brain washed to think that the society is great but they are really fighting with other countries a lot the other countries remind me of the countries that fought comunism
There plan may be to frame the firemen, but it could also be to show the citizens that the firemen the people supposidly trying to enforce the law are hypocruits and read books themselves,people may start to question why thy should follow the law if the law enforcers don't follow it themselves.
Faber seems to be one of those people that likes to keep their lives very much to themselves, but how can the firemen not have him on their radar? Do they know that Montag visited Faber?
I think there are not many people that own books. Altough we see more of them, a Bible seemed to be very unique, even though it is probably the most publised book.
@Megan, I agree, these people have been kept ignorant and dumbed down, they won't WANT to read books, even if they had a chance to read without consequence
I think that the reason that nobody really realized that he had the book was that some magazines and rule books were allowed and so they probably thought it was a rule book.
I also think that they don't want to read books even if they had access to them but I do believe that if that seed was planted, it would eventually start to spread.
@abbie I think that Faber's behavior is a little strange and suspicious. It appears to me that he is keeping some information from Montag that will affect the outcome of the book.
I don't think the public knows that firemen are allowed to keep books for 24 hours. I think that if they did, people would become curious about books or a riot would start, they might think it's unfair
Since the banning of books, have people become less religious? Faber says something about not being very religious, but reading the bible is so interesting
I think that Milldrid is dying because she is becoming more and more involved in her TV and she is becoming more unaware especially when she overdosed on her sleeping pills.
Even with risky citizens attempting to read banned books, society clutters the brain any chance it gets to make sure free thought is shattered from the start in people's minds. This makes people frustrated and may discourage them from reading ever again because of the annoyence that is present and that makes it hard to focus.
@Maria... I think that he is saying that their relationship is dying and she is "dead to him". It means that it is as if she has died and she doesn't mean anything to him anymore.
Megan and Kelsi, what do you think Faber is hiding from Montag, how will this effect their plan to frame the firemen, especially if there is broken trust involved?
I think that Mildred is irresponsible, because the level of responsibility isn't required in their government. Since Mildred doesn't have the responsibility level, she overdoses a lot.
Maybe Mildred is brain dead...not literally dying. He thinks she needs books, to get her mind back in the game. If you're happy does that necessarily mean you're living?
A major theme in this book is living but not living. I think this is what montag means when he said Mildred is "dying". A few other things that go along with this them is the mechanical hound and the "snake" at the hospital.
@Kelsie I'm not sure what the deal was with the lilies. I think that it could be a passage he was currently trying to analyze and could not because of the noise in the subway.
Abbie, I think that Faber might be hiding being a coward. He may actually be an aggressive book hunter or something. If Montag discovers that Faber betrayed his trust, he might turn him into the firemen.
I agree with Holly and Rebecca are right. They are just there, but are they really there. Even sometimes, we zone out. I think that these people are permanently zoned out.
@mikaela, I think that Montag might eventually succeed, but that in the process he needs to struggle, otherwise it won't really be success. It will just be an ending to life the way it was.
Haley, I totally agree! that does seem like a reoccurring theme doesn't it? Another example might be how the firemen say burning books isn't hurting because they're just objects and they aren't alive but Montag begins to feel that they are alive because of the people behind them that wrote them.
When Montage referres to his wife dying, I go completely to the fact that she can not detach herself from the world that has been her comfort zone, she is not able to be saved from the type of thinking she has been taught to harness, her ability to switch to believeing books are okay has been tried and failed many times by her resistance to listen to what book can do for her. She is past the point of salvation into a world where thay can change the society so soles like hers arn't lost so soon, but a controlling society.She is "dead" to accepting a different way of thinking.
@ Daniel: I do think that Mildred will overdose again when Montag isn't there, because I think Mildred has this false idea of protection. It happens in our society when we think that nothing will ever happen to us and if anything does happen, somebody will be there to save us. I think that Mildred has this idea that someone will always be there to save her when she overdoses. However, she will probably end up overdosing when nobody is around.
I think that you could say that the reason that people "zone out" all the time is because they don't work their brains out. I think the saying that "the brain is a muscle" and if you don't "work it out" it will become weak.
Daniel, I think that Mildred will overdose again. I think that that's a problem that she might live with her whole life until it ends. And Montag might not be there next time.
@Daniel, I do think she will overdose again, and no, Montag won't be there to save her. The cycle of Mildreds life is TV, overdose, TV, overdose, she wont change, but Montag will. He doesn't want here there anymore, he isn't close enough to her to care.
I would guess that a lot of people are similar to Montag. People don't naturally want to change there habit though so I would also guess that not many people want to do anything about it.
I agree with Corey when he says that the reason people "zone out" is because they don't work their brains out. When we don't work out our brains, we forget everything. Summer is one time when we don't "work our brains out" and we do forget things that we learned the previous year.
@Jack... I think that there isn't happiness but just "normalcy" and they may feel like they truly are happy but they haven't experienced different things that may change their perspective.
@moritz, I agree. Mildred must move out of the way so that Montag can have the freedom he needs to make the decision to rebel. Of course, there is always the posssiblity that whatever might happen t Mildred will force Montag to question his purpose
@Emily: That's a really good point, we lose all that information over such a short amount of time, these people are completely used to being "zoned out" all the time, so how can they obtain knowledge?
We are a chatty society, so imagine a world where you would not be able to express your feelings or thoughts freely.Would you be able to hold all those things inside? Hidding them with out completely loosing track of them is a hard thing to do. When somthing is opressed for a long time it starts so disintegrate because of the neglect or in Montags case explode into action.
i agree with Natalie. I think that Beatty had books once but does not anymore. He read them and found out, that in his eyes, books are nothing more than ink on paper.
I think that Mildred is very content with her life when she's with her "family" and does not have time to reflect on her life. With Montag changing and forcing herself to think outside of TV, she will definitely overdose again.
@Nicole: Our society now doesn't do well with holding things in. Sometimes it kills people to hold things in. Many people in our society are opinionated and want to share their opinion with us whether we care or not. I don't agree that when something is opressed that it begins to disintegrate as sometimes some problems are unforgetable to the human mind.
I think that Nicole is right. We cannot hide these feelings forever. But, maybe in this society, people learned how to hide their feelings forever and make them disappear. But, Montag cannot which is why he doesn't seem to fit into this society anymore.
@Mikaela, he has changed from a proud firefighter, to a firefighter who's hiding books, he WANTS to learn about books, he went from gov. drone to rebel of the people. You know what I mean?
@Rebecca Faber will eventually be forced to come out of hiding if he is to help Montag in changing society. I think that it will definitely be challenging, but isn't intellect and free will worth it?
@ Kelsie - The people in the society have definitley learned to hide any and all feelings. It's pretty simple for them, go sit in their parlor...and they are instantly zoned out.
Why was the bible the book Montage chose to take to Faber? Would Faber have broke down and caved into Montage if it had been Moby Dick? What is the significance of that particlar book to the meeting Montage has with Faber? Or over all, does Montage = Simon = Jesus (maybe thats a little to far to connect)?
I think that the mechanical hound was at the door because in the beginning, when they talked about how the hound works it said that it would only have one goal and it would try and acheive it and it would be strange if the hound was after him but never followed him.
My thought is that nonfiction books, magazines, newspapers are available. It's just fiction--books that get you to think beyond the text--are unavailable.
I think of the socity kind of like one of those things they have in surgeries to monitor heart beat, it just beeps at the same rate and there isnt any change unless something has gone wrong or the person is waking up. I think that Montag is starting to wake up and he may be moving back to the waythings were before.
@sydney, yes - He has begun to live, in a sense. before he wasn't really alive before. I think that this is what Clarisse gave him and what he must now give to the world...
@Kelsey I agree that Beatty had books in one point of his life and like Montag could not comprehend the ideas behind the books. But unlike Montag, he did not pursue the books further.
@moritz, True, there is a larger ability to question fiction books and read behind them, but can't you also question non-fition? Isn't that how advances in technology are made?
@ Moritz: Life would change as we know it if fiction all over the world was banned. Nobody would come up with anything creative, because nonfiction is just factual. Fiction creates ideas, because with fictions you can create it, but nonfiction is not something that we can create, because it's just there.
If they ban fiction books, do they ban fiction TV shows and programs? They could cause just as much controversy as books can. Is all that's on is reality TV now?
@Mrs.Moritz, wouldnt that make it even more of a part of life, to use it to advertise? Granted it's not important to them by all means, but they still use it...?
Non-fiction is what actually happens the cold hard facts, so life would change as we know it because it is just stuffing a bunch of facts in your head with no fiction to come up with concepts or themes that link together the facts. This leaves non-fiction without meaning, just as bad as banning all books, a filling peoples heads with facts by way of media.
I think their non-fiction is like: war started over land...so and so won...end of story. I don't think they talk about people's opinons or what they did, or how it negatively/positvley effected society.
Fiction implies imagination. Non-fiction doesn't, but I think why they can allow such non-fiction is because when they are in school they are taught how not to think, not how to think.
I think that the people do not think that these people have any faith and if they did everyone would have to believe the same thing. But in this culture can you believe in faith?
I think there is a difference between the fiction books and tv shows because I think that some form of government is totally controlling what the programs on tv are saying/doing.
It seems to me that more nonfiction are more thought provocing than fiction. Nonfiction is written about people who did great things, or great events. Fiction is mainly just for fun, so wouldn's that inspire less thought?
i agree with megan... if we dont share our ideas... we wont share our knowledge and no one will get smarter we will just stay the same as we are the whole time
@Kelsey--I think "The White Clown" is probably fiction. @Sydney--I agree with you, but I am unsure that the general populous would understand who Jesus is based on using his likeness in advertisements. It would be like Dealin' Doug.
Adding onto what Alyssa said, we will get dumber, because the brain forgets things that we don't think about overtime, so we would forget information and not gain anything.
I think that the nonfiction they read is just empty facts, not any kind of stories that could even possily make someone think about anything but the facts.
What was he trying to fill with sand? I didn't understand that part.
ReplyDeletethe sand was compared to knowledge
ReplyDeletethe seiv and sand seem to be a metaphor for what will happento knowledge in this society and maybe even ours
ReplyDeletePutting sand in a seive represents making no advancements. The sand just falls through and he continues to try. Maybe, Montag will try and try again, but none of his ideas will stay...just fall through.
ReplyDeletethe sand symbolizes how hes trying to fill a void in his life but he can't because it's just keeps falling out and slipping through his hands
ReplyDeleteThe sieve and the sand represents the knowledge from books that he's trying to retain but he can't comprehend just yet.
ReplyDeleteIs the sieve his work for knowledge? The harder he works, the faster the society works against him.
ReplyDeleteI think that this represents the holpelessnes Montag feels, the way that the resistance never really takes hold and yet is always there, invisible.
ReplyDeletei also agree with Alyssa that sand is knowledge. He's trying to fill himself with it but he just can't
ReplyDelete@Abbie--Think as colander that you rinse pasta in.
ReplyDeleteI agree with Garrett when he says that knowledge flows in one ear and out the other ear. They don't really pay attention to it, because their government has trained them to not think about anything. They are simply brainwashed.
ReplyDeleteIs it foreshadowing of whats to come?
ReplyDeleteWill he try, but with no avail.
he had sources and people he could call if he need to copy and print books!
ReplyDeleteI think Mikaela brings up a good point that they are just going in a constant cyle and are never gonna advance.
ReplyDelete@ Alyssa - Who's knowledge? Or just the societies knowledge?
ReplyDeletei think faber is part of a black market for books and he is afraid that he will be found out the stuff in the bedroom was for him to make books with
ReplyDeleteI think that the sand represents something that Montag is missing but it just can't be filled
ReplyDeleteIs Faber actually a coward?
ReplyDeleteThe sieve represents himself and the books represent the sand because as much as he tries to understand the books and cram information in to his head, he can't remember or comprehend it.
ReplyDeleteThe plan: Faber gives him a bug to put in his ear so they can spy on the firehouses and hide books
ReplyDeleteI think that Faber has been part of a "behind the scenes" book market at some point.
ReplyDeleteDo you think that Faber has met other firemen that have taken books?, because he seems to know what the consequenses are for taking books.
ReplyDelete@mickaela, I think that this is very representative of the state of mind that Montag is in. I think that he will definetly try, and I would like to see him fail, at least at first. It would seem too perfect and too easy if his rebellion succeeds...
ReplyDeleteHaley is right, because people in this society have been trained to not comprehend knowledge. They have never had to comprehend knowledge in their life, so it's a struggle to comprehend knowledge.
ReplyDeleteI think that when this is brought up, it's like a metaphor saying that the knowledge he is trying to obtain is just leaving him. Sure he can have the knowledge for a little while, but he's not used to remembering facts like we are, so he loses everything he read. Just like the sand is leaving the seive.
ReplyDeleteyes the knowledge of everyone... most comenly the knowledge of the most important people in society
ReplyDeleteDaniel, I think Faber is a coward. When you say "is he really?" Do you mean that he's faking being a coward and he's actually a spy or something?
ReplyDelete@Daniel--I think so, in a sense. But I also believe that Faber, even though he is using Montag, is doing Montag a great service.
ReplyDelete@ garrett yes he probably has had other enounters like montag and his first
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteHow would the society react to books being distributed...even if it is a little at a time?
ReplyDeleteWould they be accepting, or would the "sand fall through the sieve" and everyone be angry...rejecting...and not accepting of this change?!
The plan is to frame the other firemen, that way with firemen gone, it will no longer be illegal to keep books. But how will they intrigue society to want to read books again and gain knowledge?
ReplyDeleteFaber may be pretending to be a coward, to keep his plan hidden, until he trusts Montag, then he will become more assertive
ReplyDelete@garret, I don't think so. Faber almost didn't help Montag because he was too afraid - he would not be so afraid if he had met other firemen.
ReplyDeleteI agree with Mrs. Moritz that he is helping Montag greatly but he is setting him up.
ReplyDeleteI agree with Cory when he says that Faber might be apart of the book society that we think there is. He sells books to people
ReplyDeleteI agree with Grace that if montag gets all the other firmen in trouble with books by telling on them to Beatty or someone in authority that they would come gunning for revenge.
ReplyDeleteI agree with Mrs. Moritz because while Faber is using him as a service to himslef, Montag is also getting help with realizing what he has to do with the books
ReplyDeleteI think Michaela is right when she says that he is trying to figure out how to use his knowledge. Do you know how to use something to the best of its abilites when you first get it? (rhetorical question). Montag is dealing with the same thing as we currently deal it.
ReplyDeleteI think Faber is a coward because although he wants knowledge to be open to everyone, he refuses to risk his life to improve society.
ReplyDeleteGarrett, I think Faber knows someone who has taken books, maybe it was a fireman, but I don't think it had to be. Does it seem like Faber is keeping information from Montag, even after he gave Montag the ear piece?
ReplyDelete@ Rebecca - You're right, the book would defintley be boring and too predictable if his plan is successful on attempt #1. Do you think he is he going to be successful eventually, how long will it take?
ReplyDeleteLike Garrett D. said; they have to fighting the atomic wars for some reason, maybe it's for knowledge and the struggle for power over books maybe
ReplyDeletei thnk the peole have been brain washed to think that the society is great but they are really fighting with other countries a lot the other countries remind me of the countries that fought comunism
ReplyDeleteThere plan may be to frame the firemen, but it could also be to show the citizens that the firemen the people supposidly trying to enforce the law are hypocruits and read books themselves,people may start to question why thy should follow the law if the law enforcers don't follow it themselves.
ReplyDeleteFaber seems to be one of those people that likes to keep their lives very much to themselves, but how can the firemen not have him on their radar? Do they know that Montag visited Faber?
ReplyDeleteI think there are not many people that own books. Altough we see more of them, a Bible seemed to be very unique, even though it is probably the most publised book.
ReplyDeleteI also agree that the atomic wars had to do with books because what else is there to fight for in this completely "normal" society.
ReplyDeletethe wars were over the books... but what if the books were gone... would they still find a way to have war? what would race have to do with this?
ReplyDeleteI think that Montag will be successful but it will be a long and hard journey.
ReplyDeleteYes Abbie, I think that Faber is hiding information from Montag. I don't think he trusts quite enough yet to tell him everything.
ReplyDelete@ Mikaela, I think that with a little help, he will eventually figure things out, but it won't go as he planned for it to go.
ReplyDeletethe part with 2 wars seems a little exagerated because of teh cold war
ReplyDeleteIf Montag had the book in the subway, why wasn't he getting in trouble for having the book in the wide open?
ReplyDeleteWhat was the deal with the "lilies"?
ReplyDeleteIs he reading the Bible, or reading things in/our of the subway?
ReplyDelete@Megan, I agree, these people have been kept ignorant and dumbed down, they won't WANT to read books, even if they had a chance to read without consequence
ReplyDeletehe was reading the bible while riding the subway
ReplyDelete@ Abbie: I think that he might have been hiding the book or perhaps they are just extremely unobservant in this society.
ReplyDeleteWas The Lillies of the Feild a book as well as a movie?
ReplyDeleteAbbie, maybe it was a slow time and there weren't that many people on the subway so no one saw him.
ReplyDeleteIf books ever truly disappeared (as in there were no more rebels), would the world return to the way it was before? Would anyone notice?
ReplyDeleteI think that the reason that nobody really realized that he had the book was that some magazines and rule books were allowed and so they probably thought it was a rule book.
ReplyDeletethe commercial is representing the conflict between knowledge and brainwashing
ReplyDeleteI also think that they don't want to read books even if they had access to them but I do believe that if that seed was planted, it would eventually start to spread.
ReplyDelete@abbie I think that Faber's behavior is a little strange and suspicious. It appears to me that he is keeping some information from Montag that will affect the outcome of the book.
ReplyDeleteWhy would Montag even go out into the open with a book, knowing how rejected they are by society? I think he is smarter than that...
ReplyDeleteI don't think the public knows that firemen are allowed to keep books for 24 hours. I think that if they did, people would become curious about books or a riot would start, they might think it's unfair
ReplyDelete@rebecca i think they wouldnt notice but it would be different for the people who accually pay attention to the things going on around them
ReplyDeleteSince the banning of books, have people become less religious? Faber says something about not being very religious, but reading the bible is so interesting
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteI think he is saying that she is overdosing. She will most likely do it again, so she will die.
ReplyDeleteI think that Milldrid is dying because she is becoming more and more involved in her TV and she is becoming more unaware especially when she overdosed on her sleeping pills.
ReplyDeleteshe pops way too many pills so shes probably really messed up
ReplyDeleteEven with risky citizens attempting to read banned books, society clutters the brain any chance it gets to make sure free thought is shattered from the start in people's minds. This makes people frustrated and may discourage them from reading ever again because of the annoyence that is present and that makes it hard to focus.
ReplyDeleteWell, she's ovedosed countless times and is completely checked out most of the time. Maybe he really feels like she is on her way to death. :(
ReplyDelete@Maria... I think that he is saying that their relationship is dying and she is "dead to him". It means that it is as if she has died and she doesn't mean anything to him anymore.
ReplyDeleteMegan and Kelsi, what do you think Faber is hiding from Montag, how will this effect their plan to frame the firemen, especially if there is broken trust involved?
ReplyDeleteShe may either be dying because she overdoses but it may also be a metaphor for their marriage dying because they're growing apart.
ReplyDeleteI think that Mildred is irresponsible, because the level of responsibility isn't required in their government. Since Mildred doesn't have the responsibility level, she overdoses a lot.
ReplyDeleteFaber says that they had a college paper only 50 years ago. What events could've caused the fast demise of writing and public information?
ReplyDeleteRebecca, I don't think anyone but a select few would notice, they dont want it back, they have moved on
ReplyDeleteMaybe Mildred is brain dead...not literally dying. He thinks she needs books, to get her mind back in the game. If you're happy does that necessarily mean you're living?
ReplyDeleteI think that that is relevant (Mrs. Moritz) but I still think he is overall talking about how she's "dead to him".
ReplyDeleteI think that they are all somewhat dead. They do not know what it means to be alive, or why they should live. They aren't really alive. They just are.
ReplyDeleteA major theme in this book is living but not living. I think this is what montag means when he said Mildred is "dying". A few other things that go along with this them is the mechanical hound and the "snake" at the hospital.
ReplyDelete@Kelsie I'm not sure what the deal was with the lilies. I think that it could be a passage he was currently trying to analyze and could not because of the noise in the subway.
ReplyDeleteAbbie, I think that Faber might be hiding being a coward. He may actually be an aggressive book hunter or something. If Montag discovers that Faber betrayed his trust, he might turn him into the firemen.
ReplyDelete@garrett the people mey not want information just to be momentaraly entertained
ReplyDeleteThe passage that Grace just refered to makes me think of those creepy meth commercials.
ReplyDeleteI think that there bodies are alive and working but there brain and souls are not always there.
ReplyDeleteI agree with Holly and Rebecca are right. They are just there, but are they really there. Even sometimes, we zone out. I think that these people are permanently zoned out.
ReplyDeleteI agree with Mrs. Moritz. They may be living...but their life is messed up greatly.
ReplyDeleteDo you think Mildred will overdose again, except this time Montag won't be there to save her?
ReplyDeleteHe does fear for her health... he cant live without her but he doesnt really know what it feels like to be living with her
ReplyDeleteThose creepy meth commercials could be symbolic of how Montag fears Mildred's life will end up, but maybe less dramatic...
ReplyDelete@mikaela, I think that Montag might eventually succeed, but that in the process he needs to struggle, otherwise it won't really be success. It will just be an ending to life the way it was.
ReplyDeleteHaley, I totally agree! that does seem like a reoccurring theme doesn't it? Another example might be how the firemen say burning books isn't hurting because they're just objects and they aren't alive but Montag begins to feel that they are alive because of the people behind them that wrote them.
ReplyDeletemildred seems to be a lost cause so i think he means he intelect is dying
ReplyDelete@Daniel--I definitely think something bad will happen to Millie. :(
ReplyDeleteWhen Montage referres to his wife dying, I go completely to the fact that she can not detach herself from the world that has been her comfort zone, she is not able to be saved from the type of thinking she has been taught to harness, her ability to switch to believeing books are okay has been tried and failed many times by her resistance to listen to what book can do for her. She is past the point of salvation into a world where thay can change the society so soles like hers arn't lost so soon, but a controlling society.She is "dead" to accepting a different way of thinking.
ReplyDelete@abbie I think that Faber is maybe hiding facts from his own past that has led him to become such a coward.
ReplyDelete@ Daniel: I do think that Mildred will overdose again when Montag isn't there, because I think Mildred has this false idea of protection. It happens in our society when we think that nothing will ever happen to us and if anything does happen, somebody will be there to save us. I think that Mildred has this idea that someone will always be there to save her when she overdoses. However, she will probably end up overdosing when nobody is around.
ReplyDeleteI think that you could say that the reason that people "zone out" all the time is because they don't work their brains out. I think the saying that "the brain is a muscle" and if you don't "work it out" it will become weak.
ReplyDelete@griffin, Mildred has no intellect, she does not thnk, no one doe, hence their lack of life, dispite the fat that they are not dead.
ReplyDeleteDaniel, I think that Mildred will overdose again. I think that that's a problem that she might live with her whole life until it ends. And Montag might not be there next time.
ReplyDelete@Daniel, I do think she will overdose again, and no, Montag won't be there to save her. The cycle of Mildreds life is TV, overdose, TV, overdose, she wont change, but Montag will. He doesn't want here there anymore, he isn't close enough to her to care.
ReplyDeletethey have a continus routine
ReplyDeleteAlyssa, what do you mean that Montag "can't live with out" Mildred, he said he wouldn't cry if she died?
ReplyDeleteI agree with Nicole..As Mildred referenced her parlor being her safe place...a place for her to escape reality.
ReplyDeleteI totally agree with Cory. These people become brain dead because they never work their brain because they never learned how to.
ReplyDelete@Daniel and Mrs. Moritz I think that if some thing happens to Mildred then it might be to eliminate her for simplicity's sake like Clarisse.
ReplyDeleteI would guess that a lot of people are similar to Montag. People don't naturally want to change there habit though so I would also guess that not many people want to do anything about it.
ReplyDeletewho said they are happy they are just appeased never really happy with life just living it
ReplyDeleteThey have no free thought which makes it hard to have any feeling
ReplyDeleteI agree with Corey when he says that the reason people "zone out" is because they don't work their brains out. When we don't work out our brains, we forget everything. Summer is one time when we don't "work our brains out" and we do forget things that we learned the previous year.
ReplyDelete@ Sydney - How will Montag change? (Besides the possible death of his wife)
ReplyDeleteMikaela, how the parlor is her safe place, that reminds me of how teenagers put in their head phones to check-out. Almost like a safe place.
ReplyDeletehe doesnt know what its like to be "by himself" without her, he counts on her being at home to talk to and to make him food
ReplyDelete@Jack... I think that there isn't happiness but just "normalcy" and they may feel like they truly are happy but they haven't experienced different things that may change their perspective.
ReplyDelete@moritz, I agree. Mildred must move out of the way so that Montag can have the freedom he needs to make the decision to rebel. Of course, there is always the posssiblity that whatever might happen t Mildred will force Montag to question his purpose
ReplyDeleteNicole, that's exactly it, she WONT'T change her point of view, so to all things she could learn, she is dead.
ReplyDelete@Emily: That's a really good point, we lose all that information over such a short amount of time, these people are completely used to being "zoned out" all the time, so how can they obtain knowledge?
ReplyDelete@ Alyssa - Don't you think Montag has basically been living alone. He rarley interacts with Mildred...and they sleep in seperate beds.
ReplyDeleteWe are a chatty society, so imagine a world where you would not be able to express your feelings or thoughts freely.Would you be able to hold all those things inside? Hidding them with out completely loosing track of them is a hard thing to do. When somthing is opressed for a long time it starts so disintegrate because of the neglect or in Montags case explode into action.
ReplyDeleteBeatty had books at one point but I agree with Natalie that he doesn't have any books now.
ReplyDeletei agree with Natalie. I think that Beatty had books once but does not anymore. He read them and found out, that in his eyes, books are nothing more than ink on paper.
ReplyDeleteI think Beatty had a fall from faith with books and he doesn't want Montag to do the same.
ReplyDeleteWhat will happen to Faber? Can he continue to stay hidden? Is this possible?
ReplyDeleteI think that Mildred is very content with her life when she's with her "family" and does not have time to reflect on her life. With Montag changing and forcing herself to think outside of TV, she will definitely overdose again.
ReplyDeleteDoes Montage equat zoned out=death?
ReplyDelete@kelsey i agree because that does happen its their way of "getting away" the go to the place where its quiet, peaceful and nice
ReplyDeleteI agree with Makaela, it's like Montag and Mildred aren't even living together. For Montag, Mildred is just there.
ReplyDeleteI think that Faber will eventually be found out if Montag is found out because of their ties.
ReplyDeleteithink the dog at the door was just his imagination because he is afraid of the concequesses of having books
ReplyDelete@Nicole: Our society now doesn't do well with holding things in. Sometimes it kills people to hold things in. Many people in our society are opinionated and want to share their opinion with us whether we care or not. I don't agree that when something is opressed that it begins to disintegrate as sometimes some problems are unforgetable to the human mind.
ReplyDeleteMontag didn't want to risk loosing the last copy of the Bible, he wants it to have a chance...hence him needing to make a copy.
ReplyDeleteI think that Nicole is right. We cannot hide these feelings forever. But, maybe in this society, people learned how to hide their feelings forever and make them disappear. But, Montag cannot which is why he doesn't seem to fit into this society anymore.
ReplyDelete@Mikaela, he has changed from a proud firefighter, to a firefighter who's hiding books, he WANTS to learn about books, he went from gov. drone to rebel of the people. You know what I mean?
ReplyDelete@Rebecca Faber will eventually be forced to come out of hiding if he is to help Montag in changing society. I think that it will definitely be challenging, but isn't intellect and free will worth it?
ReplyDeleteI agree with Abbey because it feels like there is no personal connection between them, it just seems like they just "put up with" each other
ReplyDeleteI disagree with Griffin. I don't think that the hound at the door was his imagination because Mildred heard it too.
ReplyDelete@Griffin, but Mildred heard it too, so are they both hallucinating?
ReplyDelete@ Megan: I think that intellect and free will are worth it, but will everybody else think it is worth it or will they fear it?
ReplyDelete@ Kelsie - The people in the society have definitley learned to hide any and all feelings. It's pretty simple for them, go sit in their parlor...and they are instantly zoned out.
ReplyDeleteWhy was the bible the book Montage chose to take to Faber? Would Faber have broke down and caved into Montage if it had been Moby Dick? What is the significance of that particlar book to the meeting Montage has with Faber? Or over all, does Montage = Simon = Jesus (maybe thats a little to far to connect)?
ReplyDeleteI think that the mechanical hound was at the door because in the beginning, when they talked about how the hound works it said that it would only have one goal and it would try and acheive it and it would be strange if the hound was after him but never followed him.
ReplyDeleteMy thought is that nonfiction books, magazines, newspapers are available. It's just fiction--books that get you to think beyond the text--are unavailable.
ReplyDeleteI think of the socity kind of like one of those things they have in surgeries to monitor heart beat, it just beeps at the same rate and there isnt any change unless something has gone wrong or the person is waking up. I think that Montag is starting to wake up and he may be moving back to the waythings were before.
ReplyDelete@sydney, yes - He has begun to live, in a sense. before he wasn't really alive before. I think that this is what Clarisse gave him and what he must now give to the world...
ReplyDeleteI agree with Mark because the people don't think that there will be any good in books.
ReplyDeleteI agree with Grace, if the text doesn't influence or make people think...it's acceptable.
ReplyDelete@ Sidney and Kelsie mildred seems to be loaded on her sleeping pills so she could hallucenate all the time
ReplyDelete@Kelsey I agree that Beatty had books in one point of his life and like Montag could not comprehend the ideas behind the books. But unlike Montag, he did not pursue the books further.
ReplyDeleteIs the goverment censoring knowledge or books?
ReplyDeleteI agree with you for the most part Moritz, what do you think is the faith aspect of life because the Bible is banned.
ReplyDeleteI agree with Moritz. Things that are black and white are available to the public, but not books that can be argued.
ReplyDeletebanning free thinking!!! this is because they dont want anyone smarter than the others
ReplyDeleteSo, do you think that if fiction all over the world was banned, yet we still had non-fiction, life would change as we know it?
ReplyDeleteMoritz, in the last section Beatty says that Non-fiction books are banned too
ReplyDelete@moritz, True, there is a larger ability to question fiction books and read behind them, but can't you also question non-fition? Isn't that how advances in technology are made?
ReplyDeleteEven if they aren't reading anything of substance how much thought would it really take to read something with a message?
ReplyDeleteDoesn't nonfiction inspire revolution too. Gearge Washington, Gahndi, Nelson Mandela, ect.
ReplyDelete@Corey--considering they use Jesus in advertisements, I cannot imagine that religion is very much a part of the lifestyle.
ReplyDelete@Griffin, but how would they both hallucinate at the same time, and see the same thing??
ReplyDelete@ Daniel - The government is censoring free thinking and inequality.
ReplyDeleteI think that even without fiction books, revolutions would start anyways especially with history books when people see what has been revolutionized.
ReplyDelete@ Moritz: Life would change as we know it if fiction all over the world was banned. Nobody would come up with anything creative, because nonfiction is just factual. Fiction creates ideas, because with fictions you can create it, but nonfiction is not something that we can create, because it's just there.
ReplyDeleteYes Daniel, good thinking.
ReplyDeleteWho writes the books that aren't banned, like the non fiction things that people are allowed to read?
ReplyDeleteI also think there would have to be books for people to even be able to read if they wanted to.
ReplyDeleteIf they ban fiction books, do they ban fiction TV shows and programs? They could cause just as much controversy as books can. Is all that's on is reality TV now?
ReplyDelete@Daniel Books are people's thoughts and knowledge written down on paper, so by banning books they are banning knowledge.
ReplyDeleteare there books that arent banned
ReplyDelete@Mrs.Moritz, wouldnt that make it even more of a part of life, to use it to advertise? Granted it's not important to them by all means, but they still use it...?
ReplyDeleteNon-fiction is what actually happens the cold hard facts, so life would change as we know it because it is just stuffing a bunch of facts in your head with no fiction to come up with concepts or themes that link together the facts. This leaves non-fiction without meaning, just as bad as banning all books, a filling peoples heads with facts by way of media.
ReplyDeleteI think their non-fiction is like: war started over land...so and so won...end of story. I don't think they talk about people's opinons or what they did, or how it negatively/positvley effected society.
ReplyDeleteAbbie, good question; Maybe you are assigned that job at a specific age. I'm not really sure.
ReplyDeleteFiction implies imagination. Non-fiction doesn't, but I think why they can allow such non-fiction is because when they are in school they are taught how not to think, not how to think.
ReplyDeleteI think that the people do not think that these people have any faith and if they did everyone would have to believe the same thing. But in this culture can you believe in faith?
ReplyDeleteI think there is a difference between the fiction books and tv shows because I think that some form of government is totally controlling what the programs on tv are saying/doing.
ReplyDeleteIt seems to me that more nonfiction are more thought provocing than fiction. Nonfiction is written about people who did great things, or great events. Fiction is mainly just for fun, so wouldn's that inspire less thought?
ReplyDeletei agree with megan... if we dont share our ideas... we wont share our knowledge and no one will get smarter we will just stay the same as we are the whole time
ReplyDelete@Griffin,I don't think so, not actual books, just comic books and magazines filled with pictures.
ReplyDelete@Kelsey--I think "The White Clown" is probably fiction. @Sydney--I agree with you, but I am unsure that the general populous would understand who Jesus is based on using his likeness in advertisements. It would be like Dealin' Doug.
ReplyDeleteI agree with Megan. They are banning thinking be banning books.
ReplyDelete@Moritz non-fiction does contain more facts but fiction contains more deep thought, and therefore, it is more dangerous.
ReplyDeleteAdding onto what Alyssa said, we will get dumber, because the brain forgets things that we don't think about overtime, so we would forget information and not gain anything.
ReplyDeleteI think that the nonfiction they read is just empty facts, not any kind of stories that could even possily make someone think about anything but the facts.
ReplyDeleteThe plan, once they "get rid of" the firemen, can't the society just get new firemen??
ReplyDelete@kelsie, you can't ban thought, you can only teach people how not to think. Books help people learn to think...
ReplyDeleteThere could be a possibility that if non-fiction books are allowed, the government must control the information.
ReplyDeleteIf the White Clown is fiction, then why isn't it banned? Is it because TV doesn't provoke thought like books d?
ReplyDelete@ Garrett: Facts are still knowledge and the government doesn't allow knowledge. Even though it's empty facts, it still knowledge.
ReplyDeleteWhy does Montag yeild to being a puppet yet again? He is thinking more but he is still a puppet.
ReplyDeletePeople with books are considered insane, would a fireman with books be taken away and put in a ward of some kind?
ReplyDelete@Rebecca, so if they ban books and books provoke thought, they are technically banning thought.
ReplyDeleteKelsie, that's a good question, but most likely they censor what they put on tv so that thoght won't be provoked.
ReplyDeleteWhat excuses will Montage use for resining his job as a firman? How will he approach Beatty about his departure from the force?
ReplyDelete@abbie if the fireman are gone there will be no anti book enforcement so books will make a comeback before there can be new fireman
ReplyDelete